Freedom Is the Allowing of All States - 27 Apr 2015

Cornelia has a question. He says, 'Does the witness occur simultaneously with the phenomenal world?' If this was true, then how would you know that there is something called sleep? Even if there was no clock watching and you went to sleep, when you wake up from sleep you are aware, 'Oh yes, I went to sleep.' There was no mind, there was no phenomenal object. You say there was nothing there, and yet you were there to see that there is nothing there. See? So the witnessing is present even in the sleep state. Otherwise, you would not know of a state called sleep. You would just think that once in a day something happens miraculously and the clock moves forward by a few hours or something like that. Therefore, the witnessing is ever-present in all states, independent of all states. And there is no entity called the witness, even though the phenomenal world, see what happens with awareness also, it seems you're in your own something being seen. Not a phenomenal attribute can be assigned to you. Yes. And if you're not an entity, if you have no attributes, then you cannot be touched by any occurrence in the world. All your materializations might be going up, like it's happening with animation, they might go, all be blowing up, what's happening with many. Last thing to be giving up on us. So all this can happen. In fact, the entire world can go into pieces, but you remain untouched.

So when all these things are happening, we must see them as grace, as opportunities to see that how untouched I am. And sometimes we feel, 'I'm strongly attached to something,' but when it goes, this is quite okay. So sometimes the belief about attachment is also stronger than the attachment itself. So when the pointing comes 'stay as the witness,' and you see many pointings... another idea, and then I were talking in the morning and she said that somebody at this point in Kitty, Kitty had this pointing that all you have to do is sit up, is to stand up, and to lie down. The rest is all just a story. She was saying that Kitty said this. Then the Buddhists, many Buddhists also say that your only job is to breathe. When the job is to breathe, that's all you have to do. The rest is all, you see? So these are very helpful pointings and they're much more accessible. So I would say that you are just witnessing. You are just witnessing. But that is for you, because you've been in satsang for a while and you can fathom what I'm saying. You are just witnessing. For others in general, it's much easier to say that the only job is to breathe, only job is to sit up, stand up, and lie down.

Yes, yes. Ultimately that is the question, you see. If this question comes... so as long as there's a sense that 'I am the doer,' then this, when they say it's not like they don't know there is no doer, but because they know it's not completely accessible and right now there's so much suffering, so they want to give you a sweetie, a candy, to make you feel better. They say, 'Okay, the job is to breathe.' And the doership gets related only with this sense of doing the breath. All the rest is unfolding, which itself is very strong. Then this question will arise. This question will arise: so who is the one who is breathing also? Then you realize that there is no one, no individual entity, no person doing anything at all. But it's a good step from presuming that 'I'm doing everything, everything' to just 'I'm only breathing.' Very helpful pointer to me. So you will come to this conclusion that you are not doing anything. Witnessing, being aware, is not what you're doing. It would be a doing only if it could be switched on and off. It just is here. Being is not doing; it's just being. There's no effort. You cannot be more or be less. You cannot do more being. 'Let's all get together and be.' You cannot put more fire into this energy. Same way you cannot witness more. 'Let's just witness, keep your eyes bigger.' Witnessing is just happening. Eyes closed, eyes open, senses operational or unoperational, the witnessing continues. That's why Guruji says, 'What takes no effort, it takes no time.'

I've been able to watch a lot of just doing and realize that I'm not the one doing this. Where I am finding a little confusion that's coming is: okay, I'm not doing it as a person, what am I doing it as? Consciousness? And I'm not really clear on that point further about Consciousness doing it, because I was reading an excerpt of yours and it says Consciousness is doing.

It is good because we haven't touched on this for quite a while. Consciousness is the light of the movie projector. This is the light of the movie projector. Then who is doing the movie? In the presence of this light, this movie is playing. Awareness is like the witness of the movie. There is no movie without the light, you see. So in the presence of this light, the closest we can come to saying anything about it is to say that the light itself is projecting the movie. But the light is not actively involved in the play of the movie. It is just light is integrated. So this light of Consciousness, that can be the closest thing we can say as to what is projecting this movie. So it's not like actively doing. 'See, now I will become Jewish and I will do this. Now I will become another and I will do this.' It's not like you're just projecting the entire movie. This entire universe which you are aware of, it's just playing. And all the intelligence of how the movie moves—whether there is karma or not, whether there is gravity or not, whether there is electricity or not—all of this is present only in the light of Consciousness. In sleep there is none of this, yet in waking the light switches on and this movie seems to be here, you see. So even as Consciousness, you're not consciously doing anything.

You are not... Consciousness is not relying on you as a person to do anything, right? Though the person wants to take it on and say, 'Yes, yes, now I am Consciousness, therefore I am now moving my hand as Consciousness.' That is a mind trick. This mind can never become Consciousness; it's also appearing in the light of Consciousness. So no person has ever been able to use this concept that Consciousness is the doer. When you feel that, 'Okay, now that I know this I should be able to tweak my life around a little bit and, you know, can I get a better house? Can I get some more something because I am Consciousness now?' It doesn't work. It's a big relief. Yes, that's how it is meant to be. That's what it's meant to be. For many initially it's scary. For many initially it's scary. 'Oh my god, who's running my life?' You say it's just Consciousness. Sometimes you want to just get out of this. You're like, 'Okay, can I get out of this?' just because I'm not doing it. But the fact is that this one... signal is very good now... this one which is complaining about life and how it should go and, you know, wants to get out of here, this one has just always been imagined.

Even at this realm of the phenomenal world, I want all of you to get this today with what I have repeated many, many times. So many of you will see, but it looks real. You know, this table is real; he hit his head on it, it caused a bump or whatever. Yes, so it seems real. So how can you say this world, this phenomenal world, is not really touching me? So I see, okay, if that's where you are and all of this seems completely real—this body is real, this table is real, everything appearing is real—even at this level of phenomenal reality or not, can you show me the person? You can show me the body; the person you cannot show. And then if you cannot show me the person, then who has the desire? Who has the attachment? Did the body want a better job? Does the body want more money? Does the body even want a perfect relationship? Does the body want freedom?

Touching me, so I see, okay, if that's where you are and all of this seems completely real—this body is, you know, this table is real, everything appearing is real—even at this level of phenomenal reality or not, can you show me the person? You can show me the body; the person you cannot show. And then if you cannot show me the person, then who has the desire? Who has the attachment? Did the body want a better job? Does the body want more money? Does the body even want a perfect relationship? Does the body want freedom? And if it is not the body, then who is it? I have no trouble presuming all of this is real, it's fine. But yet, even if all of this is here, then where is the person? You're here for freedom, so who is the one who wants it?

So I say, somebody comes to your door and says, 'I want to talk to you about something very important.' We will most naturally first ask, 'But who are you?' So in the same way, you say that 'I want freedom,' so can I then ask: who is this one who wants it? And in this question itself, if you can see that it doesn't exist, then you see the freedom was always here. Freedom was only from this identification as a person. There is no other true freedom; all the rest is just experiences. So don't chase after any experience. Don't even chase after an awakening, so-called awakening. 'This happened to him, this happened to me, why doesn't this experience that somebody else had happen to me also?' This can become another trick, you see. It takes you away from the now into another desire, another expectation.

Regarding an awakening experience, I was speaking to one of you who had one of these, and I was saying the benefit that you have, the advantage that you have, is to the extent that when doubts come, and strong doubts come, you can refer back to that experience and say, 'No, this is not available.' So to those who have had an awakening experience, you have a strong shield against doubt, because doubt is bound to come. Somebody also typed earlier: doubt is bound to come for everyone. But when this doubt comes, then for those who had awakening experiences, they can just quickly check back and say, 'In the presence of this one, this happened. Is it possible for this to happen anywhere else? Can I go to a doctor and get it? Can I go to any sort of anywhere else in the world and can this be replicated?' So use this as your shield, but don't make it something special. Don't make it something special. You've been given a special shield to shield yourself from doubt; that is the extent of the advantage.

But it also comes with a lot of disadvantages. Any experience, any strong experience, and the most important disadvantage is this sense of specialness which can come along with it: 'This happened to me, it's not happened to him before, I am more awake,' this kind of stuff. And the second thing which can happen is that you can say, 'Oh, I had it, it's so beautiful, I just want to be like that.' So you're still grasping for something which is past instead of being fresh into the present, you see? So everything in life balances itself out. If something has advantages, it also comes with disadvantages, and every expression of Consciousness is moving perfectly according to just exactly what it is.

But the fact is that experience or no experience, you are always the truth. You are always the Self. The world itself means itself; you are that. So then very simply, very logically, all that has to be checked is: what am I right now? Whatever one side is it, who am I? The most important inquiry. Just like the drop has presumed that it is just a drop, but actually has always been the ocean, the same way you have presumed that 'I have always been just this person,' but in fact you have only been this awareness. What does the drop have to do to become the ocean? Is there practice? Which asanas, which pranayams, which meditation?

So the question of doership is again there. So let's look at it. So we say, okay, so what are the options for who could be the doer? What are the options? One: a person. Second: Consciousness. The third: awareness. Anybody else? These are the two or three options for who could be the doer. A person—does it exist? If it doesn't exist, then how can it be the doer? That puts sort of an end to it, isn't it? Because I have looked at the question of doership for many years and very deeply, I realize it all depends on what we are believing ourselves to be. And if there is still this belief that 'I am the person,' then it must rely on some level of personal doership. But if it could be seen like this, that there are only three alternatives for who the doer could be: it could be the person, or it could be Consciousness itself, or awareness.

Okay, no, person does not exist. Therefore, can it have any free will, anything at all? No. How can a non-existent entity have anything? It does not exist. It's a dreamed-up character; it's an imagined one. It's like we can imagine just now some character—we've been doing this these days—I've been saying, just imagine the 25-year-old boy who's going to school, call him. Now ask him to come help you put on the air conditioning or something like this. It's just the person has always been this imagined; it's just like this. So this imagined one, can it have free will? Just a figment of my imagination. So if this person is imagined, then what is next? Does anything happen when Consciousness is not present? Is there any experience, any doing, any action? So in the presence of Consciousness, all doing and all experiencing, tasting also happens. So you pick up a fruit and you eat it; you can only do it when Consciousness is present. Is it a taste of something? It won't be present when Consciousness is present. That's why you're saying that it is the wonder and though I'm experiencing, all doing and experiencing happens in the light of Consciousness.

Awareness is not concerned by the presence or absence of waking state, dream state, sleep state; all this is coming. So awareness is just the pure witnessing, unconcerned by any of these actions or inactions. Right?

This is yes, why you say I'm not Consciousness. You're right. I mean yes, because no, because I can see the beingness.

Yeah, he says, 'I can see beingness, therefore I must be... I mean, I'm not saying that I am awareness, but I can see the beingness.'

Yes, therefore you must be awareness.

Awareness, yes. If you are aware of beingness, if you are aware of the presence of Consciousness, your own presence—I am, the holy presence of beingness, of God—then you must be just this awareness. This is the witness even with the presence and absence of beingness.

Yes, but this is sorry, no...

It's good, no, it's very good. No need to apologize. It's a very good inquiry which I have. So you say that 'I am witnessing even the presence and absence of beingness, therefore I am awareness, therefore I am not doing anything. I'm just here witnessing, being aware.' And which is the only voice which comes and tells you that you are doing something?

Person.

Yes, this voice of the mind. You say that 'I am witnessing even the presence and absence of me.' It's quite a lag on Facebook. It's only this belief, this imagined idea of personal, the mind is always testifying to. And the mind might come now and say, 'See, I got it.' Even this can be let go of. It's still speaking to you personally.

Yes, yes, this one especially. Yes, please, which is... you just, you know, you just know, you know that that's... that's phenomenal.

You mean knowing of a concept? Then that is a function of awareness, seeing, knowing, witnessing.

All right, because we're not talking about the phenomenal seeing here. We're not talking about the perceiving through senses. So witnessing is... you see, you're not seeing, is it? You can... you will see now what's going on. I just knew that there's no effort required, and then it's effortlessness. I just knew to... let's see, seeing, you know, instantly.

So ultimately, but that's phenomenal. No, no, at this point it is not. This is prior to phenomena. You are aware of your presence. The presence is responsible for all phenomenal appearances. So what we are talking about is prior to all phenomena. You may see, are you aware now? There's no phenomenal checking required, yet there is a knowing that 'I am aware now.' Yes. So we can call this the knowing, seeing, awareness, witnessing, whatever term you want to do it. Yes, yes, the primal, the real knowing, the true knowing and the true seeing is the same thing. I don't use the word knowing because mind takes it to be an intellectual... many teachers use the word knowing, but the knowing can be confused because the knowing can be confused as something to be known from the mind as an intellectual.

Okay, I need some questions. And who had said further, 'Past few days mind has come so strongly, doubts, unworthiness, etc. I follow your pointings. It is true, I have seen no thought can last. It is wonderful to witness. Thank you.' You know, these things... I saw a beautiful photo of you and you were against some lions. It's a very beautiful photo of you and you are having some lions, but I have to tell you that these things—these doubts, this unworthiness from the mind—these are much more ferocious than the lions you will encounter in the phenomenal world. So those lions you can hug; with these lions you have to just let them come and go. Don't give them anything to eat, don't give them a hug. Let them just come and go. You are the Supreme One. You're the Supreme One. Your truth is what I am in service to. Your truth is what this voice is in service to. How can you be unworthy? This is all about you. All of this is your play, your Maya.

So there are three types of doubts that we can have on this path. We can doubt ourselves: 'I'm not good enough, I'm not ready.' So I am telling you that what you are is already free. Only you are giving some belief to your thoughts, but what you are is already free. So that is the first level of doubt. You can say, 'I am not ready, I am unworthy.' This is one. So this is not true. Second is that you can doubt the teaching: 'These words, they don't make sense, you know. Is this really true? Is he really speaking from that?' That sort of doubt can come about the words what is coming. Therefore I say, don't just take the words on. Don't take my word for anything. You verify everything. You verify everything that is being said. So when I say there is no witnesser, it is not for you to just take on and just take his words. You clarify for yourselves: is there a witnesser? Is there no witnesser? Let me be doubtful, let me be skeptical, let me verify for myself. And then you will find that these pointings are taking you somewhere which your mind has not been able to take you. These pointings take you to your own darshan. You discover your own true Self, and here the mind has not been able to reach.

Then as this happens, as you validate more and more, then the development of trust will happen. So just don't just hear what I'm saying; you must check for yourself whether it is resonating with you or not. And when you have doubts, you can come and say, 'You said this, but it doesn't make sense always.' So this is the second type of doubt, okay? First was 'I doubt myself,' second was 'I doubt the teaching,' and the third is 'I doubt the teacher himself.' Say that, 'Okay, his teaching seems authentic, but this guy, he's a bit tricky, so I don't know whether I can trust him.' So that I always said, that if anything you find, any sort of exploitation, any sort of manipulation, any sort of trickery, you must come. You must come in the hangout and expose it to the entire community. It's for everyone. We have no secret groups, we have no secrets. If you find any sort of thing which does not resonate with you, and I'm always open... in this play there will always be mistakes which will happen, so I am always open to admitting if there are some mistakes. But you come up when you say that, 'I have checked my doubts, I feel I am ready, I am open, I am here. I checked the teaching and they seem to work, but you know, these parts of you, the things that you do, need me to have some doubts about you.' So I'm very happy to have these kind of conversations because if you get over these little, little things about why...

With you, and I'm always open. In this play, there will always be mistakes which will happen, so I am always open to admitting if there are some mistakes. But you come up when you say that is, 'I have checked my doubts. I feel I am ready. I am open. I am here.' And check the teaching, and they seem to work. But you know, these parts of you, the things that you do need me to have some doubts about you. So I'm very happy to have these kind of conversations because if you get over these little, little things about yourself, about the teaching, and about the teacher, then you're much more open and there's so much more resonance. So use doubt as your opportunity for inquiry. Use anything that comes. It seems to be negative, it seems to be away from the path—you use that itself to add more fuel to the fire of the inquiry.

And then Cornelia had said, 'In everything, the witness and the phenomenal world appears in awareness.' Everything appears in awareness. The person and the witness don't even appear phenomenally because they are entities, seemingly imagined entities. And it is the person itself which feels like it is initially, but even this identity of the witness... but the phenomenal appearances appear within awareness through the play of its dynamic aspect called Consciousness.

Radha says, 'Namaste Father. Feels like coming up but can't make it to the hangout. Bringing here all that wants to hide, all that can be burnt, all the specialness that is momentarily identified.' Everybody's been having some strong... she went back from here the other day. We had a beautiful visit with her and she went back, and it was raining a lot and the roads were clogged with water. So on the way back, water went into the engine and the car stalled, so they had to walk back. All this kind of satsang has been happening for many of us. Our computers are blowing up, other gadgets are blowing up. Maybe it started with Parvati; his computer was the first one to blow. So it's all fine, it's all great. Questions?

And if I know that the belief is not... there's still a tension. Yeah, and those will never stop, okay? They are still... I just have to be away from them. I accept. Does that make sense? Yes, of course. I just cannot touch them, but they're just there all the time.

What you will find is that the mind does not stop, but the belief will keep getting reduced and reduced to the extent that mostly you will find that the mind has lost this power to make you suffer. Even the sense of arrogance and specialness, it will become very rare, only with some button which is, you know, giving you something about some belief. So although the mind does not stop, its ability to grab you, this temptation of the mind, that is reducing. Every satsang, that will reduce. And there are things which have been discarded which you don't even know about. There's so many tendencies, so many things which were carried which are now gone. And one day we might look back and see there was a point where I really believed that about myself.

Now you can really expose it. When I was many years ago, I must have been 23, 24, and I was with this... with my then girlfriend in Canada and we'd gone out there. And it's been one of the most traumatic experiences of my life. One night, Father, and I... somebody after clubbing, we went to this place, this friend's house, and they gave me some magic mushrooms. Yeah, so I'd never done anything, I'd never tried it. And somebody gave me a cup. Is it okay to expose it? Yeah. So somebody gave me a cup and I didn't know you were just supposed to sip it. I drank the whole thing up, right? And I just chewed up all of it. And I had a very, very bad experience and I thought I was going to die. You know, I actually thought I was going to die that night. And what was strange is I was lying in bed seeing myself dying, but I couldn't get out of myself. You know? So maybe it was actually... it wasn't... my body was sleeping but I was awake. And that part that was awake was freaking out. And for years, Father, I had a problem still to, you know, carry that weight of that fear. I've carried that fear too, you know, and I'm glad... it's been exposure, so I'm putting everything. I thought I was going to die, but that flashback has come back so many times, so many times, and it caused me severe depression for many, many years, severe anxiety. Even now, if I were to go in a lift, I always feel like I feel stuck. Exactly, exactly. You know? So I don't know why I'm telling you this, I don't know how I came here, but I just want to expose it because even now if I'm stuck in an elevator, it gives me like that big anxiety. You know, it just comes up. I don't know why I'm doing this now. I forget what I was saying about this.

You see that in spite of all of this that happened, was awareness touched by it? You said that the body was asleep, but you were still there witnessing this sense of fear. All this fear of dying—that which is witnessing, was that also fearful? Even now, some anxiety comes in the lifts, you see, and my building is very scary. It's a very good opportunity for you to go inside. Here comes anxiety, comes. Is the witnessing really touched by any upsets?

No, it just happens that the fear becomes so intense that it kind of clouds the... like, you know, it's a scene.

You know what makes emotions intense is our resistance. Yes. For you to be completely open, you are infinite space. You are that in which the universe is born and doesn't take up any space inside you. You are that in which the universe is born and that universe doesn't take any space inside you. Imagine this space. So if some emotion is coming, don't resist it. Then you will not be able to even see it as so strong and intense because it's the sort of the drama of the fight which makes it. Don't come home. All that becomes is, you know, 'If I go to sleep, I'm going to lose myself.' Do you come into this discovery that you cannot lose yourself? Because then there would be two of you: the you and the self you had something and then you lost. That could be a dual relationship. How can you lose yourself? From this, anxiety cannot last.

This is the biggest anxiety, yes.

And don't fear this anxiety. Don't fear any fears. Let them come. Realize... you find sometimes it's coming strongly. For many who come to satsang, they feel, 'Oh, satsang is going to make me blissful and happy and joyful.' But what's happening is all these past years and anxieties are coming. But I never said satsang is going to be blissful in you. It is still the mind's presumption. So if this is happening as the prasad of satsang, as the grace from satsang, that a lot of these anxieties and fears are coming, even that is good. Because you feel they're coming back; actually, they're just coming to get released. They're coming and you can then check that there is no fear of anything. Let these bodies be cut off.

I now remember, on the way here today, I remembered this experience for some reason. And then, you know, it's been so strong for me, like the whole thing of doership has been coming up very, very... it's with me all the time, the whole conversation and the environment. And then for the first time in my life, I realized I didn't do that. It just happened. And for so many years, I've taken ownership of that. And as soon as I thought about that—this was just in the car—my weight just dropped and it just became a light, Father. You know? And it's just the ownership that I have assumed of so many things, which is the cause of so much movement. It's like Mooji Ji says, right? You can sit down, but you're still carrying the suitcase on your back. And I really felt like the suitcase was just coming off my back.

You cannot judge anybody else because even they are coming from Consciousness.

Exactly. So then no guilt and no blame.

Exactly. It's still a big part of my life. No pride and no humility. None of this. All this goes once you see that Consciousness is the one doer. Then who is here to take credit or blame? And the mind will come and say, 'But it will make you passive.' So the first objection is, 'Won't it make you passive to believe that I'm not the doer?' No, the understanding is much deeper than that. It is that all the actions and the inactions have only been in the presence of Consciousness, by the light of Consciousness. So even what is going to happen in the future will be in that. It's still the person who wants to come up and say, 'But I don't want to become passive.' What happens is that when the life energy is present, then all movement happens. If no life energy is present, then try as you might, you cannot move. This is all play of this energy.

The second thing that comes: 'Okay, I'm not the doer means I can just go around and shoot people.' It doesn't happen like this. This is just another of the mind's fears. It plays these trump cards, you know, and many people buy them to reply some fear that, 'Oh, I'll become something else. My life will become terrible. I'll become irresponsible and not take care of my family.' All of this is just the common questions, common myths which the mind can say. And it's been saying that for hundreds of years and we've been buying them.

I keep quoting this example because I still find it fascinating. Almost 100 years ago, in the 1930s, the group of people sitting around Bhagwan—if you read 'Talks with Ramana' or any of the books and we read the questions—they're almost exactly the same. Almost exactly the same from almost 100 years ago. So don't let it be that... all good. So now you're here. Maybe we are all here after 100 years and we're together. So don't let it be again if you meet again in 100 years. It's okay if it has to play like that, it'll play like that. But my job is to say, don't let that... just see for yourself what you are now. The questions are the same. Let's see. The questions are very much like what we hear in satsang every day. The seekers for centuries have been asking the same question about doership, questions about intellectual understanding versus true experiencing, questions about relationships, questions about work responsibility. It's the same stuff.

If you read the Yoga Vashisht and you hear Ram talk—because the context was a little different, he was a king or a prince, so it was different—but his question was still the same: 'What is the point of all of this? I have material possessions, I have everything, but I don't seem to get any satisfaction from anything. I'm not finding any happiness and joy.' So many centuries ago, he was asking these questions. You're reminding me of the story Mooji Ji says, and I never... I'm never able to tell it well. If you heard it from him, then you just imagine him retelling it. For those who are new here, you can hear my voice.

So Ram is getting married and the wedding has been announced. And so Dashrath says, 'You please go and invite all the sages on my behalf, and you go and please invite Vashistha.' That's why I never tell it well. So he says, 'You please go and invite Vashistha.' Then he gives him his ring, his royal ring he gives him, and says, 'He will know that I have sent you once you show him the ring.' So Lakshman goes on his horse and he's reaching the ashram where Vashistha is. And he goes there and he's on the horse because he has many sages to visit, so he doesn't get off his horse. He says, 'You sage, my father the king, he sent me the prince to invite you to my brother's wedding. Please make sure that you come.' It's full of this princely arrogance.

Vashistha says, 'Okay, but freshen up a bit. Go inside the hut. Get down from your horse and keep the ring over there in a bowl.' So he gets off the horse. Okay, gets off the horse, goes inside the hut, and he sees that there's a bowl which has hundreds of rings. Same ring, the king's ring, same ring—there are hundreds of them. Now he's in shock. He had like such an experience. So he's in shock. So he comes out and says, 'Master, what is this? What kind of play is this? How can my father's hundreds of the same ring be already there?' How many lifetimes are we going to play the same game? Same game. If you come here and you...

He gets off the horse. Okay, gets off the horse, goes inside the hut, and he sees that there's a bowl which has hundreds of rings—the same ring, the king's ring, the same ring—hundreds of them. Now he's in shock. He had such an experience, so he's in shock. So he comes out and says, 'Master, what is this? What kind of play is this? How can my father's hundreds of the same ring be already there?'

How many lifetimes are we going to play the same game? Same game. If you come here and you don't get off your horse of ego, you don't let go of your pride, and as long as this ego is still there, then we have many lifetimes. We keep playing this game over. You meet this age, but you still hold on to the 'I', so you can keep meeting over and over like this. So let this be the only time when you first come to satsang that we meet as separate. Let this be the time where you and I become one. She didn't say this; I am saying to all of you: let this be the time where all of us become one. You and I become one. Lose all sense of ego, lose all sense of personhood. It never existed; it is not the truth. And yet this play can continue because there are no limits to time. But if it is true what you say and we want this freedom now, then I am here always in service to those who want freedom. Just forget about the 'me'. It is not difficult. I'm here to show you that it is completely possible.

I have often said, isn't it, if there was the 'worst seeker ever' award, that should have been given to me because there was no consistency about any of my spirituality—always jumping around here to there, one practice to another. I was truly a spiritual backbencher. But there was some openness here, and through the Master's grace, I discovered that there is truly no separation. So if it is possible for a backbencher like me, all of you are so beautiful. So just leave this 'I', just leave this 'me'. Forget about your story. Let's get tired of this adventure of meeting lifetime after lifetime. Let's merge now as well.

There will be another body, there'll be another table, there'll be another vessel for this voice to be carried. See what you are with my eyes. See what I am with my hands. Don't give belief to any imagination. This life is supremely simple. Recently, only four sets of problems we have been given. Only four sets of problems: body-related, special relationship-related, money/security/work-related, and ultimately, freedom. Extremely simple. Don't stay lost in these four. Let me see what is beyond all of these stories. Are you just that which is experiencing only these four situations in various forms? Is just this one just the owner of this body, the owner of your relationships, the owner of your bank account, the spiritual seeker? Is that it? I don't see you as that. I see you as the Supreme Self.

The same guy over and over. A few weeks ago, there was a dream here where you were looking out of these eyes, laughing, laughing, laughing—so much joy. I realized now you were always here. I realized now you always... so no unworthiness. You don't believe anything about this concept, you know, 'Somebody else has got it, somebody is so close to the Master, I am still far, I'm distinct.' It's all rubbish. Let's go beyond all this little, little stuff. It's all so personal. And see what is here now, what is true, what is eternal. Don't be a slave to your thoughts and your feelings. Don't be with them to their temptations. Yet if this play has to happen that way, it's completely fine because ultimately time is also nothing.

I see there's a question that Stina posted, which I missed last week also. I see myself... let me see now. She said to me, 'It seems like I have some control and power regarding the way I am eating, exercising, doing or not doing. It feels I can decide certain things. I have this freedom. Maybe not the greater movements in my life, but in the practical daily things.' Is this... it can seem like this for some time, you see. That's why I said the best way to look at it is: who is this 'I am' that says 'I have freedom'? So let's resolve the 'I' question first. Because mostly when free will is spoken about, it is the person which is saying 'I have some will'. It is the person, which is just another figment of our imagination. Just imagine, can you tell me something of the person which is here phenomenally? And what is here phenomenally is this body. Let me say, body is not interested in future; body has no desire for freedom. So why does it come to satsang? So what is phenomenally here, and who is that which is the witness to this phenomenon? Is that a person?

So if you come to this realization that there is no person, then who has this little bit of control? I know many Masters have said this, and it's okay initially to feel that 'I have some sense of control' because some strong fear or something can come otherwise. It's okay. Sometimes I might also say, if I find that the questioner is not ripe enough, I might say, 'Yes, a little bit you have, don't worry.' But we must now ask this: if there is no person, then whose will is it? Little bit of will, but the rest of the will of God? Suppose this were true. But you see that even the smallest action changes the entire universe. They say that a butterfly in the forest can cause a storm in Brazil or something like that. So everything... this is called the Butterfly Effect. So the smallest action—suppose you're a child and you have free will, from small free will you have that, and you do something to yourself, you fall off some place—it changed your whole life, isn't it? Just by one step. So if the child had the freedom to take that one step and then his life got overall changed for life... it's very beautiful contemplations, and I've contemplated these for a long time. But the simplest way to understand it is that if there is personal will, then there must be a person, and I cannot find this person.

And through it said, 'No, Father, that isn't me.' But you are right. Baswan said, 'Father, how do we go about handling daily situations in life until the realization happens? For a third person, we may be coming across weak. How to avoid being exploited, especially in workplace where there are laws of the jungle applied, where the fittest survives?' What is the realization that we are waiting for? Call it the Self-realization. So why does it have to take time? I know there's something to what you're saying, but let's really look at this. Is the Atma not here now? Don't you realize that this Atma is witnessing, is here? So all that is needed is for you not to believe your next thought, including about work or about anything else. That is the mind creating a set of beliefs around this. It is, 'Yes, it's good, but till you realize, at least you need to have a plan for how you will work, how you deal with your colleagues, how will you get your next promotion.' I will help you with these things, you see. Don't believe any of this. Let it come and let it go.

This famous Zen quote which I love to quote because it's so beautiful in its simplicity—it can bring you this freedom from suffering right now—says: 'Keep your back door and front door both open. Let all thoughts come and let them go. Just don't serve them tea.' So simple and so profound. Let all these thoughts come and go. You don't engage with them. Don't give them your beliefs. It doesn't say you have to stop your thoughts, meditate, bring your attention to here or there. It doesn't say any of that. This says being completely open. No other pointing is needed because you will not pretend to be bound unless you are serving it tea. And all these thoughts are about personal bondage, personal desire, or personal defense or attack. You are the Supreme Lord. The Supreme Lord just pretending to be this mere person. As I say that, if you want to see God pretending to be a person, believe your next thought. It's not an exaggeration at all. It's not even a joke. You want to see God pretending to be a person? Believe your next thought.

Santi says, 'Beloved, sleep is taking over, so I will leave now. So happy I could be here this long. Someone can take my place and hang out. Give my love.' I know that for some time zones, certain timings are not convenient and it seems to be in sleep time. But we looked at some alternatives and it didn't seem like they're able to cater to all parts of the world in any time. Maybe one day when we are fully time in the hangout... there was this feeling one time also to start like a daily hangout which starts in the morning and finishes... leave it's like a virtual ashram. So it's not necessary that I am there, but you know, the sangha would just come, it could be like a sangha room. Let's see, maybe one day it works out like that.

You killed it, very well expressed, Jayesh. It's not about figuring it out through words and thought; it's more of an energetic release into relaxation. Baswan says... okay, he said something in Sanskrit. Okay, let me try: 'Punapi jananam punapi maranam.' So again and again we have this circle of life and death. 'Samsare'... something to do with... I'm presuming you can add on to this the English translation, but I'm presuming that this clear phenomenal reality is constantly coming and going. Then he is... this is Bhaja Govindam, which is a beautiful, beautiful work, and the imploration is that just remember God, remember Govinda. Just remember and be free from all of this cycle of birth and death. Shankara was very strong in this one. So he says, practically says, 'You fools, stop doing all of this. Just remember the name of God.' It is almost like 'stupid people, foolish people'.

Cornelia says, 'I love you so much, Father.' I love you too, my dear. Google says, 'Replace me with you completely, Father.' I'm already you. We are one. Just don't believe your next thought, then show me separation. And Shivani came back, very good. Andrew says, 'God's will.' Stina says, 'This "I" is a mixture of thoughts, concepts.' Concepts are also thoughts. 'So thoughts, feelings, knowing, intuition, impulses.' So if it's a mixture of all of this, are you this mixture or are you aware that this mixture is there? Can you really become the content of the appearance? Or does it need thoughts for you to pretend that you are this? Because the truth does not need to rely on any thoughts. The truth is what it is. So are you this content which is appearing and disappearing, or are you that which is aware? You have to look. Don't go with your mind for any of these answers. Just look and see whether you can actually become a concept, you can actually become even this voice of intuition. Are these impulses not just appearances which are coming and going? And you are the eternal witnessing of all of this.

Shivani says, 'Father, what is being noticed a lot is this: "Is this it?" Thoughts. And this is so boring. There is nothing in this, like nothing to get, and a disappointment and feeling of not wanting this.' It will pull these tricks. 'What is this? It should be something glorious. Where are the fireworks? Where are the experiences? Where is the bliss? Where is the joy?' But burn these also. These which are coming, into the fire of your inquiry, and you will see that we are an unassociated being. All these forces are ever in service. Don't give any belief to all of this also. And you yourself say, 'But all this is all seen too.' Yes, and there is a big distrust in these and all these thoughts. This is very good. Don't buy from this one. Don't buy it from this one because this one is telling you the story of this jaded spiritual seeker who got it, you see the content, and they realize there's nothing in this story, you know, 'And I'm so great that I got it, I saw it was nothing, it's still so boring.' So enjoy this world.

The timing is already perfect, please don't change. Yes, in some parts of the world it's perfect, but in other parts, North America, it's not so easy for them. It's not so easy to change. Oh, Jeremy posted something. She said, 'Father, sometimes it comes that this being is not tired of experiencing. His eyes still fall prey to these temptations. Yet, Father, this is seen as another story. Awareness is untouched. Would love to check in with you on this, not sure if I'm holding anything.'

So boring. So I enjoy this world. Foreign is already perfect, please don't change. Yes, in some parts of the world it is perfect, but in other parts, North America, it's not so easy for them. It's not so easy to change. Oh, Jeremy, I posted something. She said, 'Father, sometimes it comes that this being is not tired of experiencing. His eyes still fall prey to these temptations. Yet, Father, this is seen as another story. Awareness is untouched. Would love to check in with you on this. Not sure if I'm holding anything in my pockets.'

Yes, because the trick that it tries to play is that it says, 'Okay, but now if you discover the truth, then all this beautiful experiencing will go.' But you will find that it's so beautiful and so fresh every moment. So this experiencing is—this seems to be the colored one, which is looking through the lens of 'me.' What's in it for me? Isn't it? For most of humanity, it seems like everybody is just running about looking for things. What's in it for me? What's in it for me? Like this. And then you've had a taste of not experiencing through this filter. You have a taste of not experiencing through this filter. So which one is better?

Namaste, Father. There's no question. There's no question. So for those who had this experience, then all these doubts and tricks cannot really clear. Just check back on your own experience and see that nothing can compare to this. Why would I want to go from this pure witnessing to becoming a brother who's constantly saying, 'What's in it for me? What's in it for me?' Never. No.

And I guess it's the mind saying, 'Well, because belief still goes at times and identification can come.' Is then the question of 'Am I still holding something in my pocket? Is something not fully surrendering?' But then that becomes another story within itself, which is—it's also just as much nothing as anything else. It's a subtle trick that the mind plays here.

Yes, and I've seen all of these tricks. And now I've also told you that when something comes and some things keep getting a belief over and over, use that as fuel for your inquiry. Don't let the mind make another story out of it. Don't say, 'Why does this still happen to me?' All of that, you see. Oh yes, you come back and yes, there were some beliefs, so let me use this for my inquiry.

It's—thank you, Father. Something just felt also just to bring this—most always that it's nothing. Thank you so much.

Actually, it's not. If there was really this feeling that 'I want to continue to experience personally, I want to continue living in this world as a person,' then you would not be able to come to satsang. Unless it is completely clear that this freedom is what I want in my heart, you do not want to come to satsang at all.

It's my greatest love. It's all nonsense, Father. Everything. Whenever I bring something to you, then it's like I can just see it was such nonsense. It's just so—

One of our—we won't tell you who because I'll get in trouble—but somebody very close said to Guruji this time that, 'I've been writing to you so often that I realize now that you didn't reply because it was all just mind.' So she said like that, that 'You obviously won't reply because they're all just mind moons.' I interviewed those words, but now that you see that you're saying—you're calling me that—I'm not going to argue with you. Yes, yes, it's very beautiful if you can communicate like this. Well, there will be a time also where anything that you bring up, I'll just be able to say it's nothing. It's all rubbish. Everything.

In fact, Father, if I even come up, he just saw me speaking rubbish again. Because everything, whenever I come up here, I just speak rubbish. It's just rubbish again. But it's fine.

But it's completely fine. Because it's easy to come up and you share, and the question might be somebody else's. It's completely fine. I love you so much, and this is not rubbish. Thank you. My friend also wants to come after that.

So first, you know, it seems—I said everything that seems to have been burning and it seems like there's lots of different things in the appearance, not just the money thing. But I can see how it's all in service to me. And I was just watching. There's just thoughts, really strong, seemingly strong ones that were trying to get my belief. And I was just seeing it was such a relief. There's just one that I felt to bring to you because it's here right now and it's—I can see it's rubbish. And so I just—that—yeah, it's about the physical pain in the body. Somehow it just started to get really intense the last couple days. And so what happens is I can see this voice pretending to be me that's commenting and that's worrying about it. It's like, okay, it just starts creating all these scenarios like, 'Okay, I don't have a treatment team here to help.' Like I had—it took me forever, but I found like a couple people who knew how to help the body, and I haven't found that here. So it just starts sort of when the pain comes, it's like, okay, it just starts. I mean, I know that something—you can twist it, it'll just happen on its own and it'll fall on its own. But it's been just—and I'm seeing the voice that's commenting on it and trying to create trouble, more trouble that is trying to create more suffering than what's here. And it's then it becomes a distraction. I'll just be—I can just see like I'm just resting, just watching, and this pain comes and it's just something you want to believe. Some of the thoughts, though, I just wanted—

Relax. Nothing. No, it's going to change it. So it's never the pain which is too much. Never the pain which is too much. It is the lack of acceptance of the pain which becomes suffering. The body has been—this body also speaking a little over there now. So I notice that if I walk down all the stairs from my house, there's some pain in the knees. It wasn't there like two years ago. The screen right there. Adobeans come when the body is sick. So I've always experimented with all of this. New Zealand should learn. Starting life is a big experiment. There's a lot more fun.

Once, I remember I was fully dehydrated because we were on this fundraising marathon and I was carrying—at a sling—and Sita was very small. So I was carrying her in this sling and we walked practically about ten times. But because I was carrying her, I was a forgotten room, thinking of water. So this body, the next day, I was feeling like he's going to faint. So much pain in the stomach. Wasn't retaining any water. All this was happening. And somewhere I was saying, 'No, this constant experimentation with everything that starts appearing.' Okay, so what are the thoughts now which are coming? It becomes like this. Then your entire life, including through all these situations, becomes like one big experiment.

The pain comes and it's so strong. The body is also saying, 'Wow.' But there's something which is still watching all of this. Oh, they're so strong and so real. This witnessing is unique. It's not even concerned. It doesn't even have compassion. This awareness has no compassion also. You're just witnessing. Compassion is okay. Compassion can come in the presence. Yes, that is the 'poor me.' That is not compassion. That is the victim mode. The victim knowledge. So you can feel compassionate towards our body, that's fine. But don't pick up this victim mindset because it's not like something is really happening. Because it's simple: if there's too much pain, you will lose consciousness. If you're not losing consciousness, if pain is not too much, it's just the mind which is open now. What is—have all this, take that as an opportunity to create all this doubt also.

It does not mean that the feeling that 'I must get some help'—then okay, nothing wrong with any of that. So I'm not saying when pain is there, just become—just experiment with it. If it feels like you need to go to hospital, then—then I would be identity like this. Going to hospital, they gave me two bottles of saline. It's not like, 'Oh, dehydration is happening in the body, but I am not the body.' So which is—the car needs water in the radiator. The car needs water in the radiator. So just like this, the mind comes and plays these tricks that, 'Because I'm free now, nothing should happen to my car. It should not break down.' The body can be just what the body is. Ramana Maharshi also died because of some disease in his last days. Maharaj also used to experience very strong pain. And we also used to have this strong pain and then—but the voice was still saying that, 'Yeah, I'm watching this one more time.' Before, the mind was still going over then, 'Are you close to dying or what's happening?'

Oh, this is what do you with temptation. But here what you're finding is that you're discovering your true Self. And this discovery doesn't come sometimes for millions of lifetimes. So what if this body moves? I have to sometimes say difference. So what if this body grows? It's okay. Where the words that can happen? There must be this feeling that even if it has grace without me here, and the place wants to play it this way, he wants to make a story like this—which I don't feel like—but even if it wants to, it's okay. Then we are not so much falling into the victim's mindset. Using okay, then okay, this is happening. So how much is it? I mean, you can say, 'Okay, it's not funny.' Like when I came back from Rishikesh, for one week I was just experimenting with what's happening about a week, and then come back on a Sunday. So it's like this. It's very beautiful. The body has no energy like this.

Then something came to me on the next Sunday that, 'Hey, it's been a week and nothing is really touching you, really.' But yes, the body might need some help, you know, it's been a week. So next Sunday this came and then I started the antibiotics and things like this. It's fine. So we will not also become like, 'Okay, this is just so much fun, it's just an experiment also.' But it's not—you cannot really suffer from it. You can feel the pain of it, but suffering is practically impossible. Already the pain is saying, 'Do something.' Which is something you say, 'I've done all.' Like if it is—if it is true, if you find that you're moving towards getting something wrong, you don't take it very seriously. Just know what's happening to your car. It's not happening to you. It's a beautiful car, beautiful instrument that God has given us, this body. So no neglect of it is—is not what I'm propagating. If you maintain it like you would maintain a gift from God, never confuse it to be you.

Immediately say—Ansar is also with us today. How is Rishikesh? What's wrong? Such a great energy. Have you been there before? This was your first time now? Oh yeah, actually, I was intended to go there but I was going to a wedding and the schedule was changed. So anyway, I had to go. It was a great experience. Be there next year for three days. I will be on sunshine for three days and then back to sleep. Very happy. I'm so happy. Did you get back? Zero. Your job is being given to you now. As Americans, yes, yes. And it's a bit hard to keep myself awake, but something says it is as it is. Thank you very equipment here.

And Stina says, 'Yes, I am the witnessing of all this, but the witnessing is not so juicy like the person. It is just neutral and empty. There is nothing going on.' You want to see this, then you will see that all which is going on is still appearing and disappearing just as it was. So don't expect that the appearances will change. It's just that they will lose the ability to cause this psychological personal suffering. Is it? And you'll find that as you are not so distracted with thoughts, you will find that attention can go and fully tasting this moment. So you will start experiencing life very differently, and every moment you will find is full of so much wonder and joy and beauty. Because when our attention—so the difference between awareness and attention—it seems like awareness is infinite and attention is like the world's version of awareness. This is limited. Everything here is limited in time and space. So attention also seems to be limited. So you'll find that you cannot give attention to multiple things at the same time. That becomes—

In this moment, you will start experiencing life very differently, and every moment you will find this full of so much wonder and joy and beauty. Because when our attention—so the difference between awareness and attention—it seems like awareness is infinite and attention is like the world's version of awareness. This is limited. Everything here is limited in time and space, so attention also seems to be limited. So you'll find that you cannot give attention to multiple things at the same time; that becomes tiring. Multitasking becomes tiring; it becomes difficult. And you're so constantly moved or so affected by the content of the thoughts all of the time that so much attention goes there, and the rest even rests in this phenomenal.

So when you taste the fruit and you're completely with the fruit and you're not getting distracted by your thoughts, you will find it has a much more beautiful taste. This is what the Buddhist practice of mindfulness is; it's just being completely with what is. And this becomes natural for you. What seemed like a practice earlier now is your natural day-to-day living. It is the mind that says, 'Oh, but this is going... nothing going on' or 'This has not changed.' It's just that you are not distracted by your personal thoughts now. You're not giving belief to a personal identity.

Amala says, 'My world is trying to convince me that I should have a problem or be concerned with money, or to be more accurate, to be concerned about the fact that there is no money.' It always tries to convince us this way. It can never be that what you truly need is not taken care of. This is Grace's job. She says, 'Mostly the family members seem to be trying to convince me and need to be worried in some ways.' But the world wants us to swing to their being. They find it very uncomfortable if somebody has no money and they're not concerned. 'What's going to happen?' Many of us have heard this. In my life also, many times my family has told me this: 'What's the plan? How are you going to get out of this situation?' It's okay. And we don't have to be very arrogant about it. We can just say, 'Yes, something... we were working on something.' You don't have to be dismissive if it's coming from true love and concern. You don't have to be dismissive.

When life is like this, it will try all these possible tricks to see if you will buy it. You should be unresponsive. I feel that all of you actually are much beyond buying any of this stuff. This is my blessing to you also. It's not just my feeling that you are beyond it; it's my blessings that you are. Did you see what was posted in the Sangha chat a few days ago about a job with a caravan for Mooji Sangha? I just felt to say as I thought of you a lot in my heart. You wanted to come quite some time ago. I'm so sorry, my dear. You can come.

When we started, we were talking to this... you were telling the example of Consciousness projecting life like a movie. I don't wish the mind created that picture, but it's just like a movie. Nothing is there, no one is here to do anything. Whatever... something like that, it came. And as I said, like absolutely no need for meditation, nothing. Relationship with my friends... like a little calmness and quietness in my heart. And after that, mind came and kept telling, 'But this actually matters.' I don't know what it is, something in the presence.

So the sense of the personal life just seems to dissolve on its own without any practice. Just being in satsang, being with the energy of satsang, it seems to just dissolve sometimes. And there's no sense of 'I,' even the 'I' which says, 'Is this it? Is it enough? I have understood all this also.' Sometimes this experience can come. That's beautiful. Just let it be another experience. Because when this 'I' sense comes back, then don't say, 'Oh, why did I lose it? That was so good.' It's okay. It was some beautiful passage along the way. It got you in touch with reality, which is that there is no separate person here at all. The sense of separation vanished for a few seconds. It all seemed like it's all happening on its own and I am not here actually. It seems like this: I am not even here.

Melody is there on YouTube. She says, 'It's true, you are me. We are one.' Very happy to see you, my dear Melody. You say so beautifully, 'We are one.' Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, so much energy going on. Come on. Yeah, especially in the beginning.

Fear that came up almost...

Yes, just let it come. It's very good. It's very funny that these things come, you see. Do you see? You feel like when you're away, you feel like, 'Oh, I just want to be close to him.' And then you're coming. Then when you're close, you're in my house, you're waiting for satsang to start, something can say, 'Okay, better run. This is a chance, you know.' You can rest in here. You stay for three days. That's comfort. Ten minutes.

My dear, so much love to you. Christina says, 'There is a peace as long as I am sitting silently. As soon as I'm moving and getting active again, the peace is not there anymore.' Your freedom is not dependent on which state is showing up. So don't confuse freedom to be some state, whatever the state may be. Freedom is the allowing of all states to come and go. In that way, you're not constricted, you're not closed. Just be completely open and then you will find that there is a deeper peace in this. This peace means that you as awareness are not touched by any of this. So the phenomenal is the feeling of peace and quiet that can go into noise and activity. The true peace is your peace of being untouched by any of this.

Peace sometimes also can be a confusing word, you see. Because when the sage talks about this peace which is unchanging, he's talking about the peace of awareness, untouched, unknown. But it does not mean that there are not these times that are full of activity and noise, and times where this quietness and peace is there phenomenally. But internally, inside as awareness, nothing is moved. This is the real peace. And as more and more you are now marinating in your true Self, you will see that this peace is not changing. The phenomena of peace can come and go. It's okay.

I'm going to see some of you in the hangout. You look so serious, trying to understand. Then I have to smile. Amala says, 'It's not even that we are one, because everything is in my heart. Everything is here, the whole world.' Christina said, 'This real peace, I don't know yet.' It's always been with you. It's just that we have been believing our thoughts about states which are coming and going. But this which we speak of cannot be taken away from you. Just like you cannot stop witnessing, you cannot stop being now. In the same way, this your peace, which is just the nature of your awareness itself, cannot be taken away from you.

Shivani has turned off her video so that I don't comment on her expression anymore. And she's back. Okay, so should we do some Om Namah Shivaya chanting today? Om Namah Shivaya. Moojiji. Satguru Moojiji ki Jai. Anantaji ki Jai. Thank you so much for being in satsang today. Love you all so much. Moojiji ki Jai.