Don´t Even Know Whether You Know or Not - 9th November 2017

Very simple things to say, but if you look at the world, you find that everyone is looking for themselves, themselves in some way or the other. They might be apparently looking for money, they might be apparently looking for a partner, they might be apparently looking for a better body, but they are actually finally looking for themselves. Because if they say, 'What? I will be more complete if I get my perfect one,' you want that completion. So everyone is looking for themselves, looking for themselves. But I say, where did you lose it? If you were not the Self right now, then I would say, 'Okay, let's go looking for it.' The thing with the Self is you can't even lose it. It's just that we might have picked up along the way... like we picked up a wrong idea about what I am. You picked up the idea that 'I am just this body' or 'I am just this body and this mind.' You might have also picked up the idea about the Self, an idea about God. And yet, what is your greatest idea about God? It is ever-present. Nobody says, 'I believe in a God who comes and goes.' So if it is ever-present, where must it be now? That which is ever-present, can it not be here now? If it is here now, where must we go look for it?

And as I'm using the terminology, I'm using God, Guru, Self, this discussion at least interchangeably, so don't worry about the terminology so much. Now, will you find it if you go with your thoughts saying, 'Yes, yes, a little more this, a little more that, a little more clear seeing, I am not worthy yet'? All of this, can it be true that the ever-present one can be lost just because your mind says it is lost? Do you have to take a step to go anywhere to find that which is ever-present? What are you now? If you needed a notion to become God, a concept to become God—even the concept of God to become God—then God would not be ever-present. So then what happened? If it is so simple, if it is so obvious, what has happened? How is it that we keep searching and searching?

A simple example is coming to me in the Guru Aarti in the morning: 'All those who are devoted to you, you can take away all their suffering.' Rough translation: 'In a moment, in an instant, all that we suffer from as your devotees, you can take away.' Now, we have grown up with the next line being... first it started, then the next line is almost synonymous, you see. So now we've been doing this Aarti for quite some time and what happens every time we finish? 'Bhakti-chan... okay, I still hear somebody saying...' although we know very well. And here also it comes, you see. So this is the power of conditioning. We have repeated something over and over again: that you are a body, this is your hand, this is your life, you must work hard, you must find the right partner, you must... you see? The 'I' has been stuck with this limited identity for so long that although we are seeing the truth about ourselves, we are finding what we are, this is like the power of this conditioning. This is continuing to play out.

That is why we have satsang every day, Monday to Friday, because I know that in a day you could pick up new conditioning. You could go completely notionless from here, but tomorrow you can come back and say, 'Father, I left satsang and then this happened. He did this to me or she did that to me.' And then this thing happened. And then we sit in the sun for two hours every day and say... you might leave from here and yet the power of the old conditioning can come back. This is the design of this creation. This habit is like that. As Guruji says, satsang is the rehab. We have rehab for whom? Rehab for God. From what? From this idea that 'I am a limited entity,' from the idea of the ego. Who is running the rehab? God is. Oh God, because there is only God. So God decided to play this game of being an individual ego. It wanted to taste itself in a limited form. We got... jokingly we can say we got tired. 'I need some drama in my life.' Said, 'Okay, I will play all of these beings and enjoy the taste of playing limited.' Then says, 'Enough, whatever.'

But even in the coming to this, it doesn't want an abrupt end to this movie. I don't want the novel to end suddenly. I'm coming to my godliness again, I'm dropping the notion. So many notions. Okay, whatever it might be, since you started coming to satsang, a large percentage of the notions must be gone. I'm sure there could be some that still stick around. It's okay, the sticky ones can still be there. But I don't feel really... you might even have picked up new ones, satsang notions. But at least this much must be there: that if you come openly for some time, many of your notions that you carried when you came in are not there now. At least this much has to be done. So then, just to come to this notionless existence, God is dropping, dropping.

Now, for some it happens one splat. Bhagavan had this at 14 years old or 16 years old. He had this experience where he felt like he's dying and he said, 'If I die, I want to be there to experience it. So let me lie down and see what actually happens.' And in seeing that, in the openness to the death experience, it is the same thing what I say: the fear of the unknown is like the wobbly, conceptless, notionless existence. It initially can seem a bit wobbly, but if you just say, 'Okay, let me see what happens if I just go through this,' then you will see the godliness is no big deal for you. But in going through that, some like Bhagavan, all of this conditioning was dropped. But even then, what happened in Bhagavan's life? For many years he remained in silence. That marination what Guruji talks about. So even to come to that notionless existence then can seem like, 'What is there to speak? What words are needed?' And then consciousness itself puts words into that one's mouth saying that, 'Okay, it is done in this expression, but then I want to place other expressions coming to this expression,' you see.

To hear what happened to you: 'I just dropped all my concepts about myself.' But what does that mean? What are you believing about yourself? Who am I? Ask yourself, who am I? Is it true that you are who you claim to be? That is the question. Is there truth to this notion that you might be carrying about yourself? That you are the body, that you are the mind? All these concepts that you picked up about yourself are dropped away. And many come crying in satsang saying, 'I just don't know. This is so sad, I don't know.' And I feel so happy because 'you don't know' means you are empty of a concept about yourself. You see, this is not bad news. It is only again the conditioning. We've been taught in school, 'You must know this, be prepared for your exam.' Your parents say, 'What you brought in your report card?' You see? So if you say, 'In my report card I got an "I don't know,"' it feels like it's the worst news. But it is very good news actually. Don't even know whether you know or not. You see? That empty, notionless... and yet, the fact is that even to come and report that you don't know something brings you to satsang. There is a supreme intelligence which knows the way how to log into Zoom and how to come to the house. So life continues to function in one, which means what consciousness needs to run this life is already with consciousness. Consciousness does not need the aid of thoughts. And God is saying, 'I don't know what the next...'

You don't even know whether you know or not, you see? That empty, motionlessly... and yeah. And the fact is that even to come and report that you don't know something brings you to satsang. There is a supreme intelligence which knows the way how to log into Zoom and how to come to the house, so life continues to function. In one, which means what consciousness needs to run this life is already with consciousness. Consciousness does not need the aid of thoughts. And God is saying, 'I don't know what the next scene should happen, you have some thoughts on it?' We do, but does it go according to those thoughts? Then what is the point of this plan? It says the way to make God laugh is to tell him your plans. There is no use for any notion. It is only if we consider ourselves to be something which is limited then we feel like, 'I need some advice from this inner guide,' posing to be a guide but the voice of our individual ego.

So first you put on the mask that 'I haven't got it, please take me to freedom.' So the one with the mask, nobody can take to freedom. All I can say is: Is this true? Are you really who you claim yourself to be? Is your pretense of being the body, is it true? And you have experienced millions of bodies, so you don't have to hide that under the carpet or something. The thoughts that come up are coming up only because of past conditioning. One thing that will help you a lot is if you forget about cause and effect, right? For all things there is only one cause, which is consciousness, and their effect is also felt only within consciousness.

Now what we can say is that usually from experience I can see that this sun comes out from the east every day. When I check, it has come out from the east, so I can say, 'Okay,' with some authority, 'Okay, tomorrow also it will come from the east.' But do we really know? Really, really know? So nothing can be truly said because consciousness is completely free. So you could say, yes, from experience you can say that these thoughts come as a result of all this past conditioning and you can put it into various buckets, but it doesn't really matter. The fact is that nothing moves without the will of consciousness.

If consciousness wants—if the consciousness wants to play through Samia as Samia—so apparently because you come regularly to satsang, I can say that it looks like the aspect of consciousness playing as Samia right now is done with the limited existence. Obviously, there must be actually some resonance to this, otherwise satsang would sound like torture. If it is contrary to what your heart is longing for, then you'll just be like, 'What am I doing here? This is like... I want to become a better Samia and he keeps telling me that you're not Samia.' If it is constantly this battle, then you could not continue to be in this kind of direct satsang. So therefore, there must be something which is done with this play, and yet the mind will keep coming with like offerings of what happened, what if you could play Samia but this version, Samia 2.0? The mind keeps coming up with offers for a better and better person. 'If you could only understand this, if you could only get this and you become better at it, if you only knew how to engage with the people in your life then you could become a better...' if only whatever, if only whatever the offering could be. But all referring to you as what? As the unlimited self? Nothing. So there must be something which is done with the play of the limited self which creates this for you.

The mind always has this clause saying, 'Not if all thoughts are not generated by preconditioning, then you have to listen, you have to pay attention.' But in every 'you', the 'you' that has to pay attention, can you find it? It's just an idea. So can I say don't believe your next sound? It is not because the thought itself might be phenomenally depicting something which is untrue. If it is saying 'the coconut is green,' the coconut is green, it's fine, you see? But in all thoughts, the root of it is the premise that there is a limited 'me'. Yes, what is the meaning of the green coconut for you? What is the meaning of the thoughts being this fear or that faith for you? And what is premised in that is that there is a limited Samia still, you see? That's why we call the mind a trickster. It's very well designed. Consciousness is designed, right, after all? 'What if I could give you a life like this? What if you would become like this? What if you could become like that?' You see, it tries so many different poses before you can see that I am none of this. 'I'll give you a great palace, I'll give you hundreds of beautiful partners, I'll give you the best money, your body will be so without disease.' But will it survive death? What is the point? If when we look back at our lives, the last 40 years, whatever amount of life there has been, we look back and you say it's actually been a blink of an eye. So if I lived for another 100 years, ultimately it is going. What will survive that? What will survive death? Tell me about that.

So what does the mind have to offer for that? There's some concept: 'the soul will survive.' The concept. But when push comes to shove, concepts don't help. It has to become our insight. You might have mocked up the entire... but if your wife comes and fights with you, you will still suffer because this conceptual knowledge is not heavy. It must become our living insight that I am this Self, I am not a limited entity. The body is not my container. The mind is not speaking about the reality of me; it is speaking about a tiny aspect of that aspect of consciousness which is playing as this particular character. But I am the screen for this movie, and the light of the projector, and the director, the scriptwriter, the everything. All is experienced within. How to find that? Ask yourself who you are. The minute you presume something about yourself, then there is a lot of space for doubt. All confusion is about 'I', isn't it?

Father, when you ask and then the mind supplies the answer, it feels so weird and horrible and so you want to stop asking because the mind is so quick in answering. How do you...

Yeah, but you don't have to have an aversion to the mind.

No, the answer comes so quick and so... yeah, I don't know. It is not real and if it feels horrible or you just don't want to engage in it anymore...

When the kids were small, they go through this age, they go through their sitting with their friends and anything your friends are saying, they want to be the first to respond. If you have that feel, no, the mind is like that. It feels like, 'Okay, I can tell you, I can tell you.' So but it's okay, let it speak. So when you come and go, that's what I say. It is just providing inferences, it is providing judgment. What is your insight about yourself? Don't resist the mind or fight the mind or even... who is making a judgment about the mind is also the mind itself.

The mind is horrible. It's not because it's not an experience, it feels empty. The concepts feel empty and you don't want to engage anymore and so that's where it stops. The inquiry stops.

Okay, so take an example of all of these things. Suppose the inquiry was 'Who am I?' Yes, and immediately the mind is like, 'What is all this? What's the point?'

No concepts without saying 'I'm awareness'.

Okay, but that is just words, I mean they're just concepts. So this is coming in, the thought is coming: 'I am awareness.' What witnesses this thought? This is self-inquiry 101. So what happens is that, what has Bhagavan said? When we start the inquiry, we ask 'Who am I?' The thoughts will come. Then ask yourself: what witnesses these thoughts? The thought is coming; use that to look within. Don't worry about pushing the thoughts away. Don't judge the answer of the thoughts. What witnesses that? Then some sensation can come, feel constricted. What witnesses that? So don't rely on any thought or any sensation to make a conclusion about yourself. So in this way we inquire.

There is this nothingness that comes or there are three answers that come.

Yes, but what do you want? Wait, wait. So this either nothingness or answer, what witnesses it?

Okay, what is it missing there? There is witnessing happening. To who is it happening?

Which one? Which 'me'? Is this something you saw, this 'me', or something you just inferred? Who was ruling? Take your time. Are you there? Have you gone away or are you there? You are there. At what distance are you from this witnessing?

There is no distance.

Is there a distinction? Tell me the distinction.

So something which is no distance, stuck together, then... then one is a 'me' and one is the witnessing. Tell me about this one.

I can guarantee you that this 'me' is just a presumption. One is an overall perspective. What looks at both to see the overall perspective and is seeing the limited? So how is the overall telling the limited how you found this? It is you are saying it is second hand. 'No, I am not the overall perspective, I am the limited one, therefore it must be telling me in some way what it is seeing.' It's like your sister is seeing something, she's telling you that this is what's happening and you're repeating that. You're probably not in the same class or even cheated in the exams. But is she finding this overall perspective and telling you? Is somebody else, DJs, telling you? Who is finding it? Why does it feel like both perspectives, perspectives simultaneously present?

Yes, yes.

But what is your greater position, your truer position? Atma is playing as consciousness. It is only Atma playing as if in its dynamic form. So all of this will also be present, but that which is aware of all of this is not contained in all of this. That is why you have all this imagery of Shiva and Shakti and Yin Yang and all of this. But what is your position? What is it that remains unchanging now? If all that is changing goes away, do you go away with that? You say that the witnessing is unchanging, therefore all the rest is changing. So when the changing goes, do you also go? So if you don't go and only this witnessing awareness is the unchanging, then what would you say is your truest position?

That nothingness is there. Even there is nothing, nothing at all, then everything has gone away, right? There is nothing and nothing is there.

Even that is not... that nothingness was there, is perceived afterwards?

Was it perceived afterwards or was it conveyed afterwards? How can you perceive something afterwards? You see what I'm saying? This is very important and even if many are not understanding, this point is very subtle.

We can say that nothing was there really, yes. But you were there to see that nothing is there. Can you have the perception afterwards?

Yeah, but it feels like you just realized nothing was there for the last half an hour now.

Okay, afterwards, yes. So that... then let's take the example of sleep. Yes, when the waking happens, then we can say that, 'Oh, in sleep nothing was there.' But for this I have to refer to a repository of past experience or whatever, whatever you have to say. But the perception of... but that awareness of that nothingness cannot happen later because the mind cannot fathom that. The possibility of your existence beyond existence itself, before 'I am', is an unknown concept for the mind. The mind will not get it. So it doesn't matter what it says. What is it certifying you as? Got it or not got it? Its certification is immaterial. It's like you're applying for a job for the head of DRDO or ISRO or something and you have your nursery school certificate. That doesn't matter. And we can laugh about it, but you will be surprised as to how many of us are still waiting for the mind's certificate of freedom. I come and say every day, 'You are free now, you are free now, you are free now,' but... but... but... is this the mind's certificate? Happy you're seeing that it is worthless because you cannot fathom the birth of its grandfather. Mind is just a tiny aspect of consciousness.

Father, the awareness being the overview or this thing is also a concept, right?

Yes, because that's one way you get stuck. All conscious... everything, even this distinction, qualitative distinction between the hand and the finger, awareness and consciousness...

Every day you are free now, you are free now, you are free now. But is this the mind's certificate? You're seeing that it is worthless because you cannot fathom the birth of its grandfather. Mind is just a tiny aspect of consciousness. Further, the awareness being the overview or this thing is also a concept, right? Yes, because that's one way you get stuck. All conscious everything, even this qualitative distinction between the hand and the finger, awareness and consciousness, the nominal, the non-phenomenal and the dynamic or the phenomena, is also a conceptual distinction that we make in satsang just to make the point clear. And ultimately even this is thrown away. So whether Guruji will call it business or you call it the Self, and being with Self is just being open to this moment for me, and being closed to this moment is also being with us. You cannot leave the Self.

But when consciousness... then we have to start using these conceptual boundaries, which means that when the dynamic aspect is just open to this moment fully, or in the inquiry it gets an insight about its source, that is that moment of waking up in the waking state or the awakening moment. So when I hear the instruction 'just be with us in the Self,' you don't pick up the pretender. Even if you do, you are the Self only, but you will pose as if you are something else. This is why we call it the play of consciousness. Is already picked up? No, the pretense is dropped naturally every moment. I'm happy we are having this conversation because in this are the primary doubts which we can get stuck with.

Show me what is picked up without going to a thought. Is something picked up naturally in your original state? Are you Samia? So you need a notion of being somebody to pick up the pretense. That's why the mind has the tougher job. So the rapid movement of mind before we realize it picks up makes it feel like it's always just... because the habit has been nurtured for so long that the smoker is now saying that 'I can't help it, I have to pick up the cigarette.' Once you come to the rehab, as you're coming, then you will find that our hand is made from that hand picks up, sometimes it drops. So belief is one of the primal forces that consciousness has created for itself as part of this play, and now consciousness is withdrawing belief from its individual identity. If the consciousness is deciding to withdraw, not in the climax way that you would agree about it, it happens at different pace for different individuals.

So the individual also has a role to play? The individual mind or whatever has a role to play to say, 'Okay, enough of all this.' It's not just the consciousness... it can't be partial to the entire humanity, right? It's like...

No, what I'm saying is, does individual have actual tangible existence? Like, can you show me the individual? As far as I see, the consciousness level is different amongst the entire humanity, and some people are more inclined for success and some people are at a very evolved stage, some people are completely not even thinking about it. So just because the movie has many characters, does it make it... let's look at it as animation. You could have drawn out hundreds of characters, each... Donald Duck is different from Mickey Mouse and both have different interests, different things that they want to do, you see? But the light of the projector is the same.

So are you that character? Are you the light? In your expression all of this is there, but when you come to satsang we are open to this question that: Am I an object in this world? Am I really an object in this world or could it be that it is the other way around, the world is an object in me? And you don't have to have had the insight of this, but at least we must be open to this question. And if it seems like too far out or something like that, then this might not necessarily be the best satsang to come to. So just this much openness has to be there: that am I purely this person? And if there is constant belief in this person identity, then is there some real basis to that belief? Otherwise we keep on working on improving the person, but becoming a better person, which has its place in the world... but there are millions and millions of places which are telling you how to become better people. This is one place where I'm saying: Can we question that basic presumption that you are a person first?

So, and that 'I don't know' is a little bit scary. 'I don't know' is a little bit scary. So we don't know in response to that fear what the next move is going to be from consciousness. If you can find that 'I don't know' and yet something is open to the looking, then you will see all these words that I am saying are not some fantasy. When I am saying that you are that light of this universe, it will be your direct tasted experience. But initially that fear of losing the identity will come. And once we see that I am not a person, there is no individual entity here, the myth about so many people in this world will also start to dissolve.

Can it be that only I am not a person? Like, someone went to Guruji long time ago and she said, 'I can see that I am not a person, but I cannot believe that my husband is not a person.' But once you really see that there is no individual entity here, all there's been is display of light and sound of consciousness itself. That's why we call it the Leela. So what is the personal? Even if the person was there, what would be its role? Moving with the will of God? What is the person's role if every dialogue which is going to come from the actor's mouth is going to be the will of consciousness? What is the person's role? Every hand movement is going to be the will of God. What is the person's role? So it is something that we have learned. We have learned to become a person. We've been taught by people around us, our parents, and this mind has constantly taught us that we are a limited entity, we are this person. And now as we are checking, all these notions will fade away. Just a little sliver of openness and you'll see.

Here I don't say to anyone, 'Believe my words.' You don't have to believe my words. You just have to take one or two lines which you feel find some resonance in your heart with them and just look and check if it is true. As much as self-inquiry, we can sometimes... I know you have to stall words. Cash prize for anyone who can show him the person! So can I win this prize? Let me produce this person which I believe myself to be and get thousand dollars. This much. Who am I?

Just a false interpretation which is changing as per whatever God is... yes, God wants to. And also this delusion is part of the will of God. And even after understanding this, it feels like that under various situations it has to be confirmed again and again. Yes, right? It's not there.

Yes, that's what I said. He doesn't want the movie to end up properly. I say take this example often, isn't it? We go for this movie and the villains are winning in the beginning. All these four years they've tortured the protagonist, hero, hero, and he has been really suffering at the hands of the villains for one and a half hours. Then does the movie end in one scene? Treasures stepping out from this delusion also, it is experiencing. So we can make some broad generalizations, but you cannot really say it has to come out this way because otherwise what I would do is tell everybody exactly what happened in the life here for the ten years or seven, eight years that I called myself a spiritual seeker. First I went here, first I went there, I did so much in Kriya, I did so... make a prescription out of that and say, 'Here, this is how I got it.' Then ultimately from my Father in satsang. So you have to do all that and then one day show.

Not this. Then after the high voltage, as you go through the high voltage situation, the scene seems more authentic.

But what did... whether it is more or less or what the quality of it is, be notionless. Yes, there is a tendency here. This is actually the meaning of 'don't believe your next thought.' Just like be notions. Whatever it is being offered up, even if it feels like it's a very authentic report card, it will just become a notion about yourself. We do not know. That's what I was saying. How consciousness will choose to play in this moment, nobody knows. We need to pick up a notion: 'I have this' or 'I have this tendency' or 'I am like this.' And we are again labeling concept on consciousness, keeping the limitation on consciousness. You see this, Father? If the body gets sick, it's like a contraction into who wants to solve all this now.

Really strong with one little car who's keeping track. This has been a long time for your Father. For me, it's just that one small thing starts and then I feel I'm gonna forget. It's just... this is the attraction of our notions. I am saying this moment is your new life. It's very good actually, we are enjoying this because this is how it operates. Like the mind came and told me one day, you know, in the middle of inquiry everything became quiet, no notion, and he came and said, 'Stop all this, I'll give you a good life.' We'll come up with all these things. 'I want that.' I'm saying you are that, and the mind is saying 'I want that.' Is it a worthy notion? What are you willing to exchange my words for? Okay, let me put some emotional blackmail. This notion from your mind, are you willing to exchange my words for you? I am saying you are free. There is nothing to be done, there is nowhere to go. No Samia has ever lived. I want these words to be real. Every moment they are real. Every moment it is true. I am not lying even a little bit. Yes, see.

A circle of life. One daughter is leaving today, one daughter has come back today. Life always continues to play in this way. Maybe he opens the door a bit fresh. Okay. Either can you talk more about what do you mean? What do you mean by what do we really know? What do we really know? Like sun rising from the east? Yes. Do we really know? We have a concept of it. We have a perceptual experience. What are the wonderful... what do we mean by knowing? You can have a concept that the sun is so many different, so many miles away from the earth. So you could have a concept there are so many trillion stars in this sky. Just a concept. Nobody has counted the trillions of stars. It's the concept from credible sources. It's a concept that you could pick up. Now another credible source will come tomorrow, the next greatest scientist whatever can come and say, 'No, actually...'

So in this way, why I'm sharing all this is because a lot of us, we feel like they are spiritual because we have a lot of spiritual concepts. But it's not a true knowing. It's just concept. There is a soul, there is a God, there is some concept that we can have and okay, it makes us feel better, whatever reason we might have for having that. The second is perception, which our senses are bringing to us. But if you ask the scientists, if you ask those who are into quantum physics, they'll say all of this is just projection. None of this... it's all empty space actually. We're just seeing some light play of light or something. Scientists now. Then what is... so what is that which is prior or more original than all of this? To know your existence, which of these details do you need? A concept 'I exist' to exist? Or to know that you exist, do you see a visual of this existence? Did you hear the existence of you? Is it an to fail? So what is it that knows? What kind of knowing is that? It knows my existence and knows that this knowing is... I know it's at some point you become... which might become a bit subtle. So not only is the knowing of this existence, but knowing that there is a knowing of whatever it might be, including existence. Knowing knowing itself. Awareness is always self-aware. It is never forgotten itself. It's just the knowing of itself alone. So this knowing, this knowingness which we usually call awareness, is not about phenomenal conceptual knowing, phenomenal perceptual knowing, or emotion phenomenal type of knowing we cannot really rely on. There is no truth which is the unchanging truth about this. But what about...

The knowing of this existence, but knowing that there is a knowing of whatever it might be, including existence. Knowing knowing itself. Awareness is always self-aware. It has never forgotten itself. It's just the knowing of itself alone. So this knowing, this knowingness which we usually call awareness, is not about phenomenal conceptual knowing, phenomenal perceptual knowing, or emotion. Phenomenal type of knowing we cannot really rely on. There is no truth which is the unchanging truth about this. But what about this itself? That which moves your existence. No concept is needed, no perception is needed. That's why I say when I ask you the question 'Are you aware now?' you have to refer to a concept, a perception, an emotion to come to the 'yes'.

So since we open the door, the sound quality, is it better now or is it because the fan is on? Do you feel like playing? Somebody? We can see somebody. Okay, let's just pick up the tripod. Oh, you can see my hair. No, it's not easy. Okay, that's how it goes. It is. See, it has... is when existence... expecting such a... let this body just... Okay, thank you all so much for being in satsang today.